Protocols to Have ‘Profound Effect’ on Turkey-US Relations, Says Envoy

Former US Ambassador to Turkey, James Jeffrey

The fate of the Turkey-Armenia protocols will have the most “profound effect” on the Turkey-US relations, said former US Ambassador to Turkey, James Jeffrey, in a 2010 State Department cable released by WikiLeaks.

In discussing US expectations vis-à-vis Turkey’s follow through on the UN or US-imposed sanctions on Iran, Jeffrey, in a January 2010 cable said: “This [the Iran issue] will have a profound effect on [US-Turkey] relations second only to the fate of the Armenian protocols over the next year.”

After Turkey refused to sign the dangerous Turkey-Armenia Protocols, the US was quick to say that the proverbial ball was now in Turkey’s court. That statement first received much attention, when Secretary of State Hillary Clinton visited Armenia and made the statement at a press conference there.

State Department circles and officials have publicly, and privately, reiterated that point, firmly believing that the ill-conceived protocols were—and are—the only way to address the centuries-old Turkish-Armenian question, including the Armenian Genocide.

Jeffrey also says that “Major challenges with us [the US] in the coming months include the direction of Turkish-Israeli relations, the fate of the Protocols with Armenia, and the Turkish posture vis-à-vis Iran.”

In a very frank tone, Jeffrey delineates the obstacles and challenges facing US-Turkey relations as the AKP party fortifies its positions and lever within the Turkish government and society.

Jeffrey acknowledges that Turkey is pursuing “Neo-Ottoman” policy and cites a speech delivered by Turkish Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu in Sarajevo at the end of 2009, in which Davutoglu claimed that the Balkans, the Caucasus and the Middle East were better off under Ottoman rule.

“We will re-establish this (Ottoman) Balkan,” Jeffrey quotes Davutoglu from his Sarajevo speech.

Read the entire WikiLeaks cable.

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56 Comments

  1. Tsoghig said:

    What I don’t understand how the US could take these clowns (Turkish government officials) seriously when they make asinine statements such as “the Balkans, Caucuses and the Middle East was better off under Ottoman rule…we will re-establish Ottoman Balkan.” The US is smarter than to take these incredibly delusional people seriously and unfortunately with our base there, it’s like they are holding us hostage. The US needs to cut its budget, let’s start off by closing the air base in Turkey and we will no longer be held hostage by these stupid bullies.

    • manooshag said:

      Hye, Tsoghig, truths, well said. Imagine the Balkans, Caucuses, the Middle East ruled by muslim Turk leaders… self-centered, delusional, too, bully mentality which is even extended now to their victims of their Genocides – and too, as Sibel Edmonds has shown… this so-called “ally” in Washington DC… against the USA – actually an “in your face, America” Turks lying, still teaching their youth via their schooling that it was the victim Armenians who attacked Turkeys!

  2. Martin said:

    The “profound” effect will be on Armenia. A profoundly negative effect.

  3. Edik said:

    Many mosques have been built in recent years in Turkey’s neighboring countries in the Balkans. In these countries and other countries of Europe there are areas where they speak only Turkish.
    The Turkish expansion is in all areas: culture, economics and finance. It’s too late to stop this expansion!

    • albania muslim tirana said:

      as a albanian muslim balkan population mostly muslim yes Turkey send us money and we kick local christian population and make their churches turn to mosque thanks for that turkish gavornment christian population down in balkan countries sample in kosova christian population deleted there are not just nato afghan jihadist lebanese hizboullah kills christian we together kills christian and we will create balkan islamic empire not ottoman empire dont fear dear armenians

      • ashot said:

        haha and russia will allow this?? the bear will slap your face hard enough to kill thousands.. muslim empire?? ya like in iraq and afghanistan..look at what us christians did to those two muslim empires hahahahahah

        • hrag masalian said:

          yes what to turks do yours ? yours know more jihad taste with 1.5 million kufar loosing lol russia todays give money to caucaus and tatar build mosques areound of russia chechenia under the russian federation look how many christian lives there or in tatatrstan : ) look kosovo population how many christian or muslim ? look serbians in sarajevo under the bosnians : ))

  4. Arto said:

    OK, I know I am in a minority here that supported the Protocols. But I would like to ask you nay sayers out there—if the Protocols was so bad for Armenia why have the Turks refused to ratify? If it was so one-sided to the advantage of the Turks as most Armenians think, why won’t the Turks sign?
    The answer IMHO is that the Protocols were a fair compromise. No one got exactly what they want but there was enough in the compromise so that both should have ratified.

    • Gregory said:

      The protocols were not fair.

      “why have the Turks refused to ratify?”

      The Turks pulled out because they wanted to involve the Nagorno Karabakh conflict and were unable to. Furthermore, the protocols also discredited the Armenian Genocide saying that a team of historians should investigate what occured in circa 1915. We know that the Armenian Genocide was a genocide. Why should any historians have to research into it. After all, the Turks can just bribe them to deny there was ever an Armenian Genocide.

    • Դրօ said:

      Turkey wanted to ratify the protocols but didn’t because Azerbaijan is adamantly against opening the Turkish-Armenian border before the Artsakh conflict is resolved in Azerbaijan’s favour. In case you didn’t notice, the protocols drove a wedge between Turkey and Azerbaijan.

    • Jirayr said:

      For crying out LOUD ARTO!!!

      The Turkish government did NOT ratify the DEFEATIST protocols BECAUSE their intent from the beginning of this ridiculous process was NOT creating a platform for “compromise”, truth, justice, peace nor reconciliation with Armenia. It WAS to prepare for sabotage, delay, defamation, denial, distortion, controversy and confusion, resulting in a ‘turkey take all’ PR stunt that our dear Sargisyan recklessly fell head over heels for. It was all a big DOG AND PONY SHOW for the world to see Turkey as it wanted itself to be perceived as. The Turkish government’s intent was AND STILL REMAINS TODAY – to create an illusion of hollow progress with Armenia in order to reap the benefits from Europe and America. Turkish officials will do anything to keep this false facade in tact for Western consumption.

      ANY set of negotiations with Turkey towards peace MUST start with a sincere legally binding acknowledgment of the Armenian Genocide by The Republic of Turkey. Its that simple.

      Arto jun…a “fair compromise” surely isn’t a set of pathetic documents surrendering everything else the Turks didn’t steal from Armenians. A “fair compromise” starts with the acknowledgement of TRUTH and ends with the return of our RIGHTS AND PROPERTY. NOTHING LESS and NOTHING MORE. AM I CLEAR? CRYSTAL I HOPE.

      • Arto said:

        If the Turkish government’s intent was to create an illusion of hollow progress with Armenia in order to reap the benefits from Europe and the US then Turkey’s PR attempt failed. Right now Turkey is not fooling anyone. They have done damage to themselves in the eyes of the US and Europe because of the non-ratification of the Protocols. See the Wikileaks story of the ex-US ambassador to Turkey. The US and Europe don’t like to be played and Turkey will pay a price. Meanwhile Armenia has looked diplomatic and peace-seeking. This was a checkmate for Sargsyan.

        • Jirayr said:

          Arto, don’t be so naive and don’t think the Armenian Diaspora is that naive either. Sargsyan got lucky with his reckless gamble and everyone, especially the Turks, know this well. I agree Turkey’s PR stunt did fail, but not because of Sargsyan’s tact. Turkey’s PR stunt failed because of Erdogan’s Islamic fanaticism (i.e. seeking solidarity with Azerbaijan). Had the Turks signed the defeatist protocols, as Armenia did, we would now be in the middle of a highly offensive and ridiculous ‘debate’ about whether the Armenian Genocide occurred . Don’t forget the facts Arto: Our very own President Sargsyan signed a pair of documents that would allow for the re-examination of the Armenian Genocide!!! Does it comfort you to know that our own President Sargsyan signed a document to reexamine this historical fact? Is this not offensive to you and worthy of impeachment?

          Yes this protocol process has inadvertently burnished Armenia’s peaceful and diplomatic intentions but this cannot be done at the expense of relinquishing our rights and property, truth and justice. Do you understand? We cannot trade in truth, dignity, justice and our rights for the prospects of being perceived as “diplomatic and peace-seeking”. We can and should however, be able to do both without choosing one over the other: Keep strong in defense of truth, justice and our rights while maintaining open and civil diplomatic ties.

          The truth remains. Sargsyan was checkmated by Erdogan, Clinton, Medvedev and Sarkozy when he agreed to ratify a set of defeatist protocols that would call into question the historical reality of the Armenian Genocide.

          • Avery said:

            well said and articulated Jirayr.

            The minute anyone mentions ‘examining’ the AG (or words to that effect), any Armenian negotiating team should just walk out.
            End of negotiations.

            Pres. Sargsyan made an amateurish mistake in that regard, and as Jirayr said, was saved by even more amateurish mistake of Turk diplomacy: no doubt their blind hatred for everything Armenian clouded their judgement. Thank God.

          • Arto said:

            Diaporans ARE naive. All negotiations are compromises, otherwise there can be no solutions. You can sit comfortably in your Glendale home sipping coffee and eating baklava forever while criticize the Armenian government for trying to better their situation. No skin off your ass. Go ahead, cry out for Justice and Truth till your throat dries while Armenian’s emigrate from their country, leaving an empty shell.

          • Jirayr said:

            Based on your worthless rant above, I can tell you are part of the problem Arto. Negotiations are obviously compromises. What they are NOT however, is a one sided decree that relinquishes ALL of OUR peoples fiscal, moral and property rights. The objective during a negotiation is NOT to surrender all of your demands to the other side Arto. That is called capitulation.

            Tell me exactly what the Turks compromised on Arto:
            The return of OUR Western Armenian lands?
            The return of OUR stolen Christian Churches?
            The recognition of the Armenian Genocide?
            Payment of reparations for a crime against humanity?
            Issuing a genuine apology for their crime and denial?
            Or was it Artsakh’s right to self determination?

            Which one of the above did Armenia’s negotiators secure from the the so called “fair” protocol process that would have made a compromise with the Turks “fair”. Which one, you cocky ignoramus?

          • Arto said:

            I won’t call you names to lower myself to your standards. Just like most of the Diaporans I talk to you probably never read the Protocols. You all make assumptions without reading. Once you see the word “Commission’ you close your eyes to everything else. Where did the Turks compromise? For one they agreed to open the borders which Armenia desperately wanted. 2. The agreement never mentioned anything about NK.The Turks wanted to link it but they failed. Now they have gone back on their word and they have pissed off the Western Nations. See the story above.. Sargsyan won that important point and drove a wedge between Turkey and Azerbaijan. Basically Armenia got everything it wanted except the “commission”. And Jirayr do you think Armenians are so full of self-doubt that you think the Turks can disprove the genocide? – something that 95% of Historians agree with – an event that most Western nations agree with. If Armenians have doubts about proving the genocide in a “Commission” then we are a hopeless case.
            I will state again, the Protocols were a win-win for Armenia whether the protocols were ratified by the Turks or not. If the Turks ratified, the issue of NK was over and Azerbaijan could kiss NK goodbye forever. If they didn’t ratify, the Turks looked like the deceivers they are to Switzerland, Russia the US and France. Checkmate Sargsyan.

            And finally let me ask you a question. Given the choice of Genocide recognition or NK, free and clear, which would you choose hypothetically? Don’t tell me you insist on both. You have to make Sophies’s Choice here. Make up your mind my friend.

          • ilter said:

            If Armenia is self confident about its facts on the Armenian Genocide, It should not be Armenia who afraids of such a commission but it should be the Turkish side.

            What you do not see is the people of Turkey. These issues were taboo in Turkey 10 years before but the current government is professionally putting these kind f things in a process. They are taking steps small but continuous they made the same thing about military pressure on the political parties. They took steps one by one in the last 9 years. About Armenia they doing the same.

            They throw these protocols issue in front of the people, people discussed it and they digest it.You will see in a few years there will be another step by Turkish side.

            What you need to understand is no one can change the mindset of 70 million people in a year or with a protocol. It needs time, it needs small and couragious and continuous steps over a decade or more!

          • bigmoustache said:

            ARTO its not about them changing the facts of AG, sargzian gave them the opportunity, gave newspaper writers the opportunity to say the turkish side. its like soghomon tehlirian using the court to further the armenian genocide, turkey used these protocols to get their side of the story printed, and it worked.
            cigarette companies didnt deny their cigarettes were dangerous, they threw doubt into the story, just like global warming deniers

          • bigmoustache said:

            im sorry did you say diasporans are naive? were not the ones who created a xenophobic, racist aryan political party because we hadnt seen one muslim or jew in our life.

            in regards to the protocols, i saw with my very own eyes, liveral newspapers that before wouldnt dare to doubt the armenian genocide without fearing a backlash from the community, start using words to show the “2 sides” of the story. we have sargzian to thank for that. decades of work down the drain…

  5. Norin Radd said:

    They are not going to establish anything, this isn’t pre-WW I turn of the century anymore. Many nations today are much more aware and prepared to deal with this type of Pan Turkish ideals.

    • Gregory said:

      “Many nations today are much more aware and prepared to deal with this type of Pan Turkish ideals”

      Well, although Southern Cyprus has now become part of the EU, Northern Cyprus is under Turkish rule. My point is that powerful nations shall only deal with these ideals if it threatens them directly. The USA and most of europe took Bosnia’s side (a muslim country) when it came to the Serbian- Bosnian conflict. The same scenario may apply for a future Armenian- Azeri conflict.

      • Arn.Sweden. said:

        The USA and most of europe took Bosnia’s side (a muslim country) when it came to the Serbian- Bosnian conflict. The same scenario may apply for a future Armenian- Azeri conflict.

        Comment –

        The US will take the Turkish side in any future Military conflict with Armenia.
        A friend of mine has seen a Vision – the US bombing in Armenia.

        Bevere and prepere !!!.

        Arn.Sweden.

      • bigmoustache said:

        IF SARGZIAN PLAYS HIS CARDS RIGHT…
        the US owes us, we dont owe them JACK…but when youre a corrupt politian seeking US approval to legitimize your position…
        once sargzian agreed to be americas hero to the rescue (rescuing american image) the US calls of ‘fraudulent elections’ stopped.
        use your brains armos, they owe us AG recognition, they owe us Artsakh recognition. if the US ever wants to talk to us, FIRST give us AG, or Artsakh, or a security guarantee for Artsakh (US base in artsakh and a promise to intervene militarily….and if you cant give us those, then give us the best deal you can in weapons and technology (javalin anti-tank etc)
        YOU OWE US AMERICA WE DONT OWE YOU SHT!

  6. Arthur I said:

    I truly hope, no, I pray that the Turks are stupid enough to try to re-establish the Ottoman Empire. I pray that they try to do it by force, in order to have the justification to euthenize the Sick Man of Europe.

    • Artin said:

      The only ally of our nation is ourselves
      The only enemy of our nation is ourselves.
      I don’t believe neither in democracy and globalization nor in autocracy and facism
      I believe in rational mind our our nation

      US is just another imperialist country like other ones in the history it’s just there are people (not you of course) who have believed in different stories at different times. We need to be united to have a prosper and advanced nation in order to be free. We need to make our country, Armenia not US or Russia or …, a better place so that diaspora will flow to Armenia ASAP

  7. Elchin said:

    No more protocols…Armenia should be kept under economic blockade for more decades until Hayastanis understand how much messing with 2 neighbours costed them.Their economy is worse than Somalia and thousands of people leaving their homeland annually…30-40 percent of the remaining population cant afford to buy new shoe and schoolbag to send their kids to school, $137 monthly salary is their dream, 40 percent of the population dont want the holidays come because they will not be able to buy meat to put on dinner table….40-45 percent of the population are sitting on their luggages to run away from the country immediately when they get a chance…May God give you little wit, amen

    • Hayk said:

      My Idio… Elchin! Armenians have lived in this aria for 5000 years and Turkeys have only max 850 years of history all together.If you want to know about Armenia go take look at 5000 year old map and you will see that only nation and government this aria from that map is Armenia all others unfortunately but gone.
      The funny thing is that turkeys killed all armenian nation but armenian still exist and turkeys still afr ade of Armenians.
      Keep in mined Elchin 850 years is 850 minutes for history maybe not for turkey but generally is.
      Good luck idio… Friend.

    • Chris said:

      My God, you’re delusional. Where’d these statistics come from, now, really? Was it on the evening news in Azerbaijan? Go drown yourself in oil, you naive, dimwitted pawn.

      • Elchin said:

        These statistics all came from sites news.am, armenianow.com…check out you will find

    • Onnik K. said:

      The only thing that the blockade showed is that Armenia can live well without having open borders with the two barbaric turkig neighbours who arrived there from the steppes of Central Asia. The only problem with Armenia is that its leadership should stop thinking only about themselves, and consider the welfare of the people.

      • manooshag said:

        Onnik K… AYO!! Fledgling Armenia 20 years of existence has been flawed by the
        inept and self-centered leaders… from DerBedrossian to today Serge – and their cohorts.
        Good government in Haisatan will bring Armenians to their homeland… Sicj leaders have driven the citizens of Haiastan away… who did not want to be with the leaders who were still of the communistic mentalities… pocketing for themselves – and to hell with all the rest of the citizens of Haiastan! None of these leaders were PATRIOTS…

    • Tsoghig said:

      You make a valid point. I would like to help enlighten you as to why Armenia’s population in bleeding and the economy is in shambles….1. the blockade by Turkey and Azerbaijan 2. Armenia was strangled during the Genocide by the Turks of half of its population and later by Stalin splitting the country up into a weak fraction of what it was before Ottoman rule. With only half its potential population, no access to ports and land transportation only available through Georgia which for some reason is hostile to us and Iran which the US has sanctions against, what are those Hayastantsi’s left to do? Starve in their country? They have no choice but to leave because Armenia on its own is very hard to sustain. No matter what Armenians in the diaspora do, if we build factories to manufacture goods there, we’re going to have to import the goods via air, then export the goods via air and there goes all the profit. Anyway I’m sure there are people way smarted than me who have more answers. My point basically is that the situation in Armenia today is a direct result of the Genocide and of Stalin’s actions carving up historic Armenia and essentially handicapping the Armenians for good.

      • manooshag said:

        Tsoghig… Fledgling Armenia 20 years of existence has been flawed by the
        inept and self-centered leaders who are of the comnmunistic mentality … from DerBedrossian to today Serge – and their cohorts – ALL filling their own pockets
        Good government in Haisatan will bring Armenians to their homeland… Such leaders have driven the citizens of Haiastan away… who would want to be with the leaders who obviously were/are still of the communistic mentalities… pocketing for themselves – and to hell with all the rest of the citizens of Haiastan! None of these leaders were PATRIOTS – patriots whom which we recall in our Armenian history.

    • Araxi said:

      You stole our land, our churches and committed genocide of a whole nation and now you talk of wit, you twit. Go to HELL, you blood thirsty turk. Once a turk, forever a turk. Bugger off.

    • Ararat said:

      Elchin, if by “messing with 2 neighbors” you mean not only making territorial demands but actually retaking and liberating Armenian territories from our, not 2 neighbors but racial enemies as I see it, then you are right. We will mess with you until all historic Armenian territories are restored.

      In an ideal and balanced world, you would be back in your homeland in Central Asia and Mongolia grazing goats. But unfortunately we live in a cruel world, where Turks can invade with million man armies, occupy, subjugate, massacre, deport and commit Genocide against the indigenous people of a land just because they want to live free of occupation in their ancestral homeland. It’s an unjust world when Turks can carve up a homeland, thousands of miles away from their birth place, at the cost of millions of indigenous people they murdered and then talk about territorial integrity.

      Just an advice for you, Armenians are very battle-hardened, tenacious and resilient people. They respond to good deeds in a 100 fold, but they also won’t spare anything to respond to evil in a 1000 fold no matter how long it takes. It’s time the Turks right the wrong committed against the Armenians, because if not and to you no matter how desperate we may seem, your generation or your future generations will pay a heavy price.

      • ilter said:

        “Historic land”. I guess what Armenian people do not understand in genereal is in today’s world no nation lives in their historic lands! may be few exception. You are saying you were here before us. So what? Is that an argument? So many Armenian people feels that it is a valid argument in fact it is not valid it is not sound! Should we give America to the native Americans or what? If you go back enough in the history you will come up with Adam (if you are religious, if you are not you will come up with the pre-homosapience animals as the native holders of the land).

        Being long on a land does not give you the rights of the land! No EU nationalities were the place they are now just a 2000 years ago!

        So, Armenia should find a better argumentation in their claims.

        • manooshag said:

          ilter, you say ‘being on the land does not give you the rights of the land’… this applies to the Ottomans and all turkish leaders to date… The turks did not win the Armenian lands via wars… being the great warriors that the turks are supposed to be. Turks stole these lands of the Armenians via unarming citizens of an ancient and advanced nation – knowing full well this was their goal – to eliminate the Armenians for the Turks to absorb all that belonged to the Armenians, their lands, properties, culture and more. Not only committing the slaughters, rapes, tortures and marches to their death in the deserts – now labeled as ‘Genocides’.
          ilter, your leaderships gained our lands via the inhumanity to humans – not
          via wars, a people unable to protect themselves against the Asian hordes… who still today, 2011, commits the crime of Genocide… now, to the still against the Armenian victims of the Turkish Genocide of the Armenian nation, more, now still the Turkish Genocide of the Kurds.

          • ilter said:

            You still did not dismissed the argument i gave. I am saying “being on a land earlier than other nations does not give you a right on that land in todays world.” No nationality stays in the place they were 2000 years before! During the history you were gaining and losing the lands by wars, so simple truth! In today’s world the war possibility is being minimalized (at least tried to be so) In the end all nations are coming from the same source (Adam if you are a believer, or pre-homosapience creature if you believe in evolution) So the nature of this argument is invalid and not therefore not sound.

            For example about Karabag: “The original population of the region consisted of various autochthonous and migrant tribes.[15] According to the American scholar Robert H. Hewsen, these primordial tribes were “certainly not of Armenian origin”, and “although certain Iranian peoples must have settled here during the long period of Persian and Median rule, most of the natives were not even Indo-Europeans”.[15]”

            but still this fact is not a valid argument to claim Karabag should not be an Armenian soil today in my argumentation!

            I can totally understand you. Armenia gained its freedom from Ottoman State therefore they have to say negative things about that period. Every country and every nation does that! I guess you have no idea about the governmental system of Ottoman Empire… What i feel you are seeing the one side of the truth. We need open-minded people in caucasus to overcome the problems still occur in the region. We need couragous people who can read the history from other side’s eyes also. It is easy to blame.

    • Ashot said:

      So? Did your blockade work? I don’t think so. Also, I don’t think Armenia “messed’ with the western neighbor. What did they do?

    • bigmoustache said:

      ‘amen ‘? you want to convert to christianity?
      come mess with armenians again and see how we all flock to our country…i might not live there but im more than willing to die there. and when we come with a gun in one hand and a cross in the other, you can get down on your knees and say amen

  8. Hrant K. said:

    Martin and Elchin have wishful thinking! Martin you are silent because you know too little. And Elchin

    if the Armenians had no wit, as you claim, they wouldn’t be the World Chess Champions! When we reach

    your doorsteps in Angorra, Sinop and Sis, we know where (which part of your body) to shove those shoes

    and schoolbags ‘dearest’ Elchin. As General Antranig had scared your ancestors to death, history will

    definitely and imminently repeat itself, but rest assured, this time there will be no more a Bolshevik

    revolution or a Kemalist regime (which your prime minister is trying so hard to eliminate) and then you

    will unwillingly welcome the New World Orderwith a turkey in eternal oblivion!!! My best regards to the

    Kurdish Patriots and the Alawite Proud Community of the Sanjak of Iskenderoun (sorry I meant Cilicia)!!

  9. Svetlana Swanson said:

    Just goes to prove that the only dialogue you can have is the one from the vantage point of economic, military, and political power.

  10. Pingback: Protocols to Have 'Profound Effect' on Turkey-US Relations, Says Envoy – Asbarez Armenian News | Wikileaks Secret

  11. Edward Demian said:

    Turkey has a big problem. Modernity. By that I mean the advance of modern technology and information. It brought down the Soviet Union, and is instrumental in the advance of Democracy. As Turks become more educated, they will pay less attention to whats being shouted from the minatertes, and spend more time on the internet. I my life time I have seen much advancement. Just a few generations ago, the only way one knew a woman to be pregnant was to glance at her belly. Now you can buy a “pee stick” from the pharmacy and presto your answer, 100% accurate in seconds. Soon enough, you will be able to buy a “gene stick” and your ethnic Identity will be staring right there in your hand. Religion, it too is loosing ground. Religion is more of a cultural affiliation than true faith. What will happen when the population in Turkey finds out that they are not Turkish, Tatar, or Mongolian, but mostly, Greek, or Bulgarian, or Assyrian. The Anatolian populations have been terrorized by a small minority of Turkish invaders, whom have been assimilated a long time ago. DNA results show Less than 10% of Turkish genes in the general population. The Turkish government is really afraid of this. And they should be. Tukey is the last remnant of the last barbarian invasion into that part of the world. It will disintegrate into many mini-states, and history will repeat itself. I wonder what Elchin will think if he were to find out that he is really Persian, or Macedonian, or “god forbid” Armenian.

    • ilter said:

      if i would find out that genetically i am an Armenian, it would not change anything! In Turkey we do not look to nation as a genetic issue. We think the people who shares common history, believes, interests and culture are from the same nationality. It is not skull nationalism but cultural nationalism.

      • Arto said:

        This is nothing new. A lot of people in Turkey know they are not really “Turks”, but combination of different people that lived in the area. And this includes a lot of people of Armenian descend who still live in modern day Turkey and think of themselves as Turkish. This is why you see the Turkish flag EVERYWHERE in Turkey, it is trying to keep a coherent society by sending a message that they are all Turkish, under one flag and one people. But in reality it is a group of different races living in the same lands.

        • ilter said:

          Yes, but so what? which nationality is pure on today’s world?? Do you think Armenian people are pure armenians? Of course not! The argumentation you put here is applicable for all races. Cultures and races interact during the whole time (btw, it is a good thing i believe). I mean why you think that learning not pure Turkish would be a problem for people??

          • ashot said:

            no its not you retard i am armenian all my ancestors were armenian….you turks are total morans..even when the truth slaps u in ur face u still fight it..come on its ok to be armenian we are a race thousands of years old….how long has there been a turkish state? hahaha the truth shall set u free my armenian friend

  12. Edward Demiraiakian said:

    Opening the border with Armenia will be the end of Armenia. Why do you think the Americans established reservations for the American Indians? Because not to have done so, would have been the end of American Indian culture. An open border with Armenia will result into a massive influx of Turkish nationals, that would eventually overwhelm Armenia. Open borders? We already have them. We can sell and ship products to Turkey through Iran and Georgia. Armenia needs to become the Switzerland of the Caucassus, and use diplomacy and other means to get back land, reparations and justice. Recent DNA results show that most Anatolians are not Turkish. Educational programs could turn many of those into Armenians. Its not the Turks that are the problem, but Turkish mentality. Change that, and everything else will change.

  13. Jack Kalpakian said:

    Fascinating stuff. The Turks are calling America’s bluff, because they know that the US does not care one bit about the protocols. I supported the protocols, because they include a clause forcing Turkey to honor its Kars Treaty commitments. They are about one thing — delinking Turkey from Azerbaijan. At present though, it is clear that the Turks are not going to do their part and in fact they use Armenians and our constant alienation from the US as a test of the latter’s commitment to them. There is a solution to this — cut them off.

  14. Ali said:

    I want to kill this argument which I hear again and again on this site on central asian conquest and 850 years of Turks in “historic lands” of the Armenians. A study of the Mitochondrial DNA of the Turks reveal otherwise
    Mitochondrial DNA which is passed from mother to children is a preferred way for establishing descent of a person. According to studies conducted under the University of Stanford, Roy King et al. The study looked at the genetic composition of mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) in Turkey. Blood samples from Turkish volunteers were taken for this study. Their mtDNA was analyzed for specific genetic markers. Frequencies of the presence of these markers were compared to various groups within Turkey and other countries.
    Principal component analysis (PCA), a statistical tool that separates individuals on the basis of differences in their properties was employed to place each social group on a plot. The study found that only 3.8% of the population had the haplogroup N Typical of Uralic, Siberian and Altaic populations, with 1.9% of the population with haplogroup Q. The remaining haplogroup matches with the genetic markers common in the Caucasus, Eastern European and Indo-Aryan people.
    The study conclusively proves that Turks are part of the genetic landscape of Turkey. This should successfully demolish the theory of a million invaders from central asia invading “historic lands” of the Armenians and killing the locals.

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